Author Topic: revised planning application for Coate just in time for Christmnas.  (Read 12024 times)

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Offline Muggins

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Re: revised planning application for Coate just in time for Christmnas.
« Reply #40 on: December 28, 2010, 04:14:17 pm »
Alex, if you are anywhere near a copy of Community Matters mailing - in particular their magazine Volume 31 - No 3, read the cover story (What Next?) and on the 3rd page, and let me have your opinion of the advice therein.....

(I will type this up but it will take some doing!)

The way I read it is, that we should shut up and accept everything we've got coming to us.  I can't beleive it, and wonder if I'm just overdosing on the Quality street?

I'll have to start another thread.
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Offline thinktank

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Re: revised planning application for Coate just in time for Christmnas.
« Reply #41 on: December 28, 2010, 07:38:39 pm »
Eric Pickles has made lots of political mistakes let him find his way he has only been doing the job for less than 6 months, give him time then he will be as good as Michael Gove. Communities are a thing of the past if Eric Pickles gets his way here is

PLANNING THE REVOLUTION

With his hand picked Core group in place, Pickles began searching for detained policy inspiration. He contacted Conservative Central Office and asked if they had a model radical "manifesto" for a local authority like Bradford. The answer was "No". But Pickles was assured that plans were well underway for a central government onslaught on local authorities which would lay the groundwork for Tory controlled councils throughout the land. The plans were later made public following the Tories' June 1987 General Election victory, when Thatcher announced plans to take her policies "into the inner cities".

Nicholas Ridley was brought in to run the government's Department of Environment, with former Wandsworth council leader Christopher Chope as his junior. Ridley was set to introduce radical plans to change the face of local government.

His biggest and most unpopular move would be to bring in the Poll Tax (although this was the brainchild of Kenneth Baker). But other changes would be established to force local authorities into accepting privatisation of service provision.

Ridley was later to set out his vision for Britain's local authorities when he referred to a hypothetical American council, which met only once a year in order to award new contracts to private companies.

Ridley also encouraged local government Tories to take up the fight. In a pamphlet he wrote called "The local Right" he urged radical right-wing Tories to become more overtly and ideologically political and to begin the task of breaking down the councils "monopoly provision" role.

In the meantime, as the government was preparing it's strategy, Eric Pickles was referred to the network of "independent" right-wing organisations that were busy preparing the way for this local government revolution.

Pickles began studying various pamphlets. He coyly concedes to reading documents from "The Centre for Policy Studies, the Bow Group, the Tory Reform Group, stuff like that." But of course there was a wealth of such material available, including works from the Adam Smith Institute, Aims, the Institute of Economic Affairs, the Freedom Association and the Institute of Directors. Other material included "Down with Rates" by Michael Forsyth - a Westminster councillor and consultant to private contractors Pritchard Services Group and "A long way to go" published by the Selsdon Group.

Another key document was the "Coopers and Lybrand Study" commissioned by the Department of Environment. Coopers and Lybrand are the country's largest accountancy and management consultants firm. They would later be brought in by Pickles to help sort out his own privatisation plans. Their study recommended that local authorities should sell off practically everything; markets, golf courses, theatres, public halls, vehicle and ground maintenance, cemeteries, catering, sports centres, accounting, computing etc.

He has been planning this for years so you'll all be lucky and very thankful if you get anything.


Offline Muggins

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Re: revised planning application for Coate just in time for Christmnas.
« Reply #42 on: December 29, 2010, 08:59:51 am »
"Their study recommended that local authorities should sell off practically everything; markets, golf courses, theatres, public halls, vehicle and ground maintenance, cemeteries, catering, sports centres, accounting, computing etc."

Well that is certainly VERY close to what's happening.

Funny that they are locally calling it 'One Swindon'  Did Pickles have any plans for who would do what was left?   That'll be us then, if we play ball.
Lifes not always fair. Sometimes you can get a splinter even sliding down a rainbow. - Cherralea Morgen

Offline Alex

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Re: revised planning application for Coate just in time for Christmnas.
« Reply #43 on: December 29, 2010, 10:55:10 am »
Alex, if you are anywhere near a copy of Community Matters mailing - in particular their magazine Volume 31 - No 3, read the cover story (What Next?) and on the 3rd page, and let me have your opinion of the advice therein.....

(I will type this up but it will take some doing!)

The way I read it is, that we should shut up and accept everything we've got coming to us.  I can't beleive it, and wonder if I'm just overdosing on the Quality street?

I'll have to start another thread.

Sorry Muggins- nowhere near a copy- where could I get one from?


And regarding THinktank's contribution, this is almost unbelievable, I would have considered it a conspiracy theory worthy of RobMagic  if it wasn't so evident that this really is what is happening. And it doesn't feel good, nor right. It is insidious and manipulative and nothing to do with what we are led to beleive is democracy- taking away any sense of self or individual power. .

Makes you ask again- why are we trying to inflict this on countries with dictators? What is the real difference?

And if we don't play ball? The victims will be countless.

No wonder so many people are getting so angry- its a sure fired way to start another revolution.

Offline Muggins

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Re: revised planning application for Coate just in time for Christmnas.
« Reply #44 on: December 29, 2010, 11:11:43 am »
I'm about to start a new thread and having just typed up the Community Matters piece 'What Next' I can say that thinktank says is not a conspiracy theory - it's about to happen.   
Lifes not always fair. Sometimes you can get a splinter even sliding down a rainbow. - Cherralea Morgen

Offline Jean

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Re: revised planning application for Coate just in time for Christmnas.
« Reply #45 on: December 30, 2010, 06:55:02 pm »
Swindon Link has put up a good article about this here:

http://www.swindonlink.com/news/coate-housing-plan-cut-to-900-homes


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Offline Des Morgan

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Re: revised planning application for Coate just in time for Christmnas.
« Reply #46 on: December 30, 2010, 07:54:18 pm »
Quote
"Their study recommended that local authorities should sell off practically everything; markets, golf courses, theatres, public halls, vehicle and ground maintenance, cemeteries, catering, sports centres, accounting, computing etc."

Before you cast these thoughts aside at least consider them very carefully.  Perhaps a golf course isn't what council tax money should be used to provide?  I remember when golf was an elitist 'sport' and where membership of the Golf Club was restricted to the great and the good. Maybe sports centres are best left to people like David lloyd? Have you thought less of the Wyvern since the Council licensed a third party company to run it?. 

Sadly, some tough choices do need to be made as to what facilities council's should be running

Offline Muggins

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Re: revised planning application for Coate just in time for Christmnas.
« Reply #47 on: December 31, 2010, 08:46:01 am »
Des,  I get the  'licence to run it'  I'm involved with at least two local groups which do just this - nothing as fancy as the Wyvern.  The thing here is the 'licence'  that can be withdrawn probably at very short notice, so the asset stays firmly in the ownership of SBC and therefore us.

Locally - at a community level, it's a great way to do things and keep them in the hands of local people.  It also gives people, who may never have had the chance before, to have a  bit of hands on management, this can be used as  enducational tool and get work experience etc. It would be better if there was a Lease (tenure secure for  aperiod of years) rather than a Licence to enable them to raise money to make improvements to buildings.

Nagging again, but we are still awaiting the Boroughs Community Asset Transfer Policy. I know this has not moved forward because we have not been consulted. :santa_cheesy: Had we had consultation before the last (and only) draft was launched we might well have had a working document by now. If we don't soon get one  me and a few friends will write one for them and charge them for it!

So I can see the sense in handing over some of our assets to others to run, but if open spaces and parks are handed over and expected to be run as a busines, we will all soon be buying season tickets to take a walk in the park. And there was us thinking that's why we were paying our council tax. there is always the improtant difference between leaseing/licensing and selling off!

As for the Golf Clubs and SBC Gym's. Private gyms are extremely expensive to use and would exclude some people from using them.  If the Parks and open spaces go too, where will the harder up go for their exercise?  Stick to the paths next to roads I suppose.

All of the above have a range of issues attached to them, health, education,  well being, well, you get my drift.
Lifes not always fair. Sometimes you can get a splinter even sliding down a rainbow. - Cherralea Morgen

Offline Jean

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Re: revised planning application for Coate just in time for Christmnas.
« Reply #48 on: December 31, 2010, 10:12:02 am »
Totally agree, Muggins... but back to the topic in question.

This is the story in today’s Swindon Advertiser (pasted in below). It is clear from what Cllr Greenhalgh says that this planning application will get planning permission.  I can't see his logic: “I think this development will protect the character of Coate Water and should prevent building between this land and Coate itself. "
 
The article also says that the Council is likely to make a decision about the planning application in February or March - we don’t have long to get people to write in with their objections.
 
 
http://www.swindonadvertiser.co.uk/news/8763730.Fight_is_on_to_save_Coate_again/
 
Fight is on to save Coate again
9:40am Friday 31st December 2010

A REVISED planning application has been submitted to build homes near Coate Water.

In the latest application the original scheme to build nearly 1,000 homes on the site has been downsized following concerns from residents and official bodies.

Developers originally applied for outline permission to build an estate, including 960 homes, on farmland between the Great Western Hospital and Day House Lane.

Officials at Swindon Council said the proposed number of homes has been reduced to 890 and other revisions have been made, due largely to the objections.

The application has reignited old battles between those who support the plans and the Save Coate Campaign, which is against any building with 1km of the park.

Coun Peter Greenhalgh, the cabinet member for sustainability, strategic planning, property and transport, said the new proposal would protect Coate Water because it was designed to make it difficult for more homes to be built nearer to the country park.

But Jean Saunders, the founder of the Save Coate Campaign, said the council had gone back on its word that that the hospital building would be a one-off and, if a university wasn’t built at Coate, there would be no houses at all.

”This proposal is the best one I think that has been put forward for this general area,” said Coun Greenhalgh (Con, Freshbrook and Grange Park).

“What I would like to see is a development that is done sustainably and has minimum impact on the surrounding areas.

“I think this development will protect the character of Coate Water and should prevent building between this land and Coate itself.

“There will always be a section of the community who will say ‘no building whatever.’ “I think, however, that this will protect Coate Water for future generations as opposed to detracting from it.”

However, Ms Saunders disputes Coun Greenhalgh’s view and said if the floodgates are opened developers will not stop.

She said the revised proposal would still damage the natural and historical landscape, and would open the door to further development nearer Coate Water.

“Developing that area will never be acceptable,” she said. “If permission is granted for housing and offices in that area then it would just spread across to the fields that surround Coate Water. That’s what the developers want.

“They want those prime fields that look out across the lake and who wouldn’t want to live in a house with a lovely view of Coate Water?”

Ms Saunders, who is also secretary of both the Jefferies Land Conservation Trust and the Richard Jefferies Society, is writing to object to the revised proposals and urged others to do the same.

“This area has become a cause célèbre and if it is built on then I think there are going to be a lot of Swindonians who will lose faith in the planning system,” she said.

Swindon Gateway Partnership – comprising of Redrow and Persimmon Homes – originally wanted to build 1,800 homes in the area but the plans were refused at a planning appeal in 2009.

In May, developers submitted another application for up to 960 homes, as well as facilities including a business park, a local centre, primary school and an extension to the hospital.

But objections were received from residents and expert bodies, including the Environment Agency, Natural England, and Wiltshire Wildlife Trust.

Under the revised application, the developers have reduced the housing density in parts of the estate, and agreed to limit the height of buildings to three storeys.

A 21-day consultation on the revised plans is to start on Tuesday and the council expects to make a decision in February or March.
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Offline Muggins

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Re: revised planning application for Coate just in time for Christmnas.
« Reply #49 on: December 31, 2010, 11:00:03 am »
Jean: "I can't see his logic: “I think this development will protect the character of Coate Water and should prevent building between this land and Coate itself. "

Well that's what our problem is - wobbly logic!

The best way to protect Coate and it's character and that of the surrounding land (to the water part of Coate) is to refuse any kind of development, there are reasons aplenty for refusing.

PG also says this is the best application so far - that's it SO FAR.  Keep going PG we might get something even better?

Jean: "This area has become a cause célèbre and if it is built on then I think there are going to be a lot of Swindonians who will lose faith in the planning system.” 

A lot of Swindonians already have lost faith in the planning system and subsequently local government, and the PPG's they don't take much notice of.

Lifes not always fair. Sometimes you can get a splinter even sliding down a rainbow. - Cherralea Morgen

Offline I Could Do That

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Re: revised planning application for Coate just in time for Christmnas.
« Reply #50 on: December 31, 2010, 11:22:13 am »
 :bash: :bash: :bash: :bash: :bash: :bash: :bash: :bash: :bash: :bash: :bash: :bash: :bash: :bash:

Coun Peter Greenhalgh, the cabinet member for sustainability, strategic planning, property and transport, said the new proposal would protect Coate Water because it was designed to make it difficult for more homes to be built nearer to the country park.

I'm concerned for Mr Greenhalghs' sanity. Shouldn't he be taking the ink blot test?

 :WTF: How is planning (encouraging) to build property, going to make it more difficult (not allowing planning), on this land :WTF:
The GWH lie all over again. Very insulting, to the people of Swindon.
The Regional Spatial Strategy "excuse" is long gone, so this only serves to confirm my long term suspicions, that certain members of SBC have an "over cosy" relationship, with developers.
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Offline Ringer

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Re: revised planning application for Coate just in time for Christmnas.
« Reply #51 on: December 31, 2010, 11:40:57 am »
Totally agree, Muggins... but back to the topic in question.

This is the story in today’s Swindon Advertiser (pasted in below). It is clear from what Cllr Greenhalgh says that this planning application will get planning permission.  I can't see his logic: “I think this development will protect the character of Coate Water and should prevent building between this land and Coate itself. "
 

In my opinion typical conservative councillor speak
Nice photo of him splashed on the page,
Quote
Coun Peter Greenhalgh, the cabinet member for sustainability, strategic planning, property and transport, said the new proposal would protect Coate Water because it was designed to make it difficult for more homes to be built nearer to the country park.



Translated if you deny any new developer the opportunity to build on it, then its simple, build on it before them.  Perhaps that is what he is after self publicity, for his new council forum when it launches?  Will councillor Greenhalgh contribute more pearls of wisdom/views/opinions/ information of such gravity to the new council forum that we have been threatened with promised?
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Offline 20Eyes

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Re: revised planning application for Coate just in time for Christmnas.
« Reply #52 on: December 31, 2010, 11:55:13 am »
Standard procedure.

Developer submits inflated application, Council refuses (with a wink), developer re-submits application with the amount of dwellings they wanted to build from the outset and the Council then pretends to begrudgingly claim that it's a much better application and starts to drop thinly veiled threats that if the current application doesn't go ahead then something worse may end up replacing it.

Sickening though it may be, Greenhalgh's comment does have some logic to it, given the way the planning 'system' works in this country. This is why people feel so stitched up by that system.
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Offline I Could Do That

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Re: revised planning application for Coate just in time for Christmnas.
« Reply #53 on: December 31, 2010, 11:57:49 am »
 :bottom:
I've dragged this from the Adver comments section

The door was opened to the developers by the ill thought out proposals for a University on this site. The councillors were deluded ,as the University proposal was not real, just a cover for unwanted development.
The Council now needs to designate the whole area as a nature reserve and stop this nonsense of one application after another.
Cncr Greenhalgh seems to be in favour of the application and should be stopped from any involvement in it.


Sums it up for me. We certainly don't need this person adding
propoganda news to the percieved council forum. :bottom:
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Offline 20Eyes

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Re: revised planning application for Coate just in time for Christmnas.
« Reply #54 on: December 31, 2010, 12:11:23 pm »
That's the problem with Planning Applications, always too many applications and not enough planning.
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Offline Bogomil

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Re: revised planning application for Coate just in time for Christmnas.
« Reply #55 on: December 31, 2010, 12:13:04 pm »
:bottom:
I've dragged this from the Adver comments section

The door was opened to the developers by the ill thought out proposals for a University on this site. The councillors were deluded ,as the University proposal was not real, just a cover for unwanted development.
The Council now needs to designate the whole area as a nature reserve and stop this nonsense of one application after another.
Cncr Greenhalgh seems to be in favour of the application and should be stopped from any involvement in it.


Sums it up for me. We certainly don't need this person adding
propoganda news to the percieved council forum. :bottom:

Actually the planned University development was real.

One wonders now if the University in the long run would have been a better option

Offline Martin Wicks

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Re: revised planning application for Coate just in time for Christmnas.
« Reply #56 on: December 31, 2010, 12:31:53 pm »
"That's the problem with Planning Applications, always too many applications and not enough planning."

Not enough planning. Good God 20Eyes. have you turned socialist?

Offline 20Eyes

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Re: revised planning application for Coate just in time for Christmnas.
« Reply #57 on: December 31, 2010, 01:41:46 pm »
Not enough planning. Good God 20Eyes. have you turned socialist?

I'm not sure what planning has to do with Socialism.
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Offline Mart

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Re: revised planning application for Coate just in time for Christmnas.
« Reply #58 on: December 31, 2010, 02:04:47 pm »
Shouldn't he be taking the ink blot test?

Yes.

Ink blot won by a short head.
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Offline Tobes

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Re: revised planning application for Coate just in time for Christmnas.
« Reply #59 on: December 31, 2010, 02:13:02 pm »
Quote
Standard procedure.

Developer submits inflated application, Council refuses (with a wink), developer re-submits application with the amount of dwellings they wanted to build from the outset and the Council then pretends to begrudgingly claim that it's a much better application and starts to drop thinly veiled threats that if the current application doesn't go ahead then something worse may end up replacing it.

Totally agree. It's a process predicated around the con of appearing to serve the interests of the community.
I do not agree with what you have to say, but I'll defend to the death your right to say it - Voltaire 'Entia non sunt multiplicanda praeter necessita

 

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