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  • Demolition March: November 10, 2010

Author Topic: 10.11.10 - Demolition March - Central London  (Read 9900 times)

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Offline Drone

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Re: 10.11.10 - Demolition March - Central London
« Reply #40 on: November 11, 2010, 03:07:29 pm »
It's a percentage which increases the more you pay, so as your salary increases, you pay a larger percentage back to the Student Loans Company. At the moment, it works out at £80 a month for me (and I'm pretty much on average UK earnings), which is £80 a month less I can put towards a deposit on my first home. I wouldn't mind so much if I wasn't also paying income tax and NI which, again, you pay more of the more you earn.
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Offline moley

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Re: 10.11.10 - Demolition March - Central London
« Reply #41 on: November 11, 2010, 06:41:15 pm »
It's a percentage which increases the more you pay, so as your salary increases, you pay a larger percentage back to the Student Loans Company. At the moment, it works out at £80 a month for me (and I'm pretty much on average UK earnings), which is £80 a month less I can put towards a deposit on my first home. I wouldn't mind so much if I wasn't also paying income tax and NI which, again, you pay more of the more you earn.

The other thing is the expectation to travel to get a job as well..  When I graduated, after 4 years I found myself having to commute 25 miles each way to work (I had reasons why moving wasn't practical) so very quickly a large chunk of my salary was going on petrol/car maintenance.  So £80/month could make a significant hole in peoples' disposable income. 

Moley

Offline kohima

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Re: 10.11.10 - Demolition March - Central London
« Reply #42 on: November 11, 2010, 07:44:17 pm »
Spectre makes his now usual rant on bigots etc, and how we treat overseas doctors, can I tell him that when I was 27, I had an heart attack, spent nearly a year in hospital in both germany and london, now recovered to the point where I have to have a check up every two years, this may, I went along for this check up and saw an indian or pakistani doctor, you never see the one in charge unless your a private patient or your actually in the heart ward and he comes round on his daily round check up.  I had the usual ecg tests and blood tests etc and this doctor told me that all was fine and asked me if I had any questions, I told that of late I was waking up in the night and my right arm was dead, if I sat up and raised the arm it come back to life and I then went back to sleep, he told me that it was sign of old age !!, and he then sent me a letter to confirm what he had said, a week later, I got a letter from the head man to say I had to come in the next day and have a full scan and to disreguard the diagnosis recently given!!, and Im sure you remember the 'qualified' german doctor, who when over here for his weekend overtime, killed the first patient he saw with an overdose of his dosage, and also the recent case in Devizes, where that overseas nurse switched off the life support machine of that man and didnt know how to restrart it..
Ill be glad to see the uk doctor and you can have the overseas ones mate......

Offline Des Morgan

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Re: 10.11.10 - Demolition March - Central London
« Reply #43 on: November 11, 2010, 10:29:25 pm »
Is that any UK doctor - I bet you really wouldn't have liked to have Harold Shipman visit!!!

I am interested in the bile which is being poured on the Coalition, ignoring completely the fact that Tony Blair introduced tuition fees in 1999 - in breach of a manifesto pledge and then in a act of unparallelled spite (until now) increased them three fold in 2004, again in breach of a manifesto pledge and opposition from his party.  Some six years later they are to rise three fold again (for some courses).

Personally I have no issue with students having to pay.  I actually think higher education is a choice whereas primary education is a statutory responsibility and should be free.  Courses which benefit society - such as medicine and its derivitatives should be subject to a discount and as a result the recipent should be contracted to the NHS for a period of time.  That's no different to a student on a Forces placement - you do your degree get paid while you are doing it and get your fees paid, in return you serve a period of years in the Forces.

Perhaps media studies should be sponsored by the BBC or some other media

Offline moley

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Re: 10.11.10 - Demolition March - Central London
« Reply #44 on: November 11, 2010, 10:48:14 pm »
Is that any UK doctor - I bet you really wouldn't have liked to have Harold Shipman visit!!!

I've had good and bad experiences with both UK and overseas doctors myself...

Quote
I am interested in the bile which is being poured on the Coalition, ignoring completely the fact that Tony Blair introduced tuition fees in 1999 - in breach of a manifesto pledge and then in a act of unparallelled spite (until now) increased them three fold in 2004, again in breach of a manifesto pledge and opposition from his party.  Some six years later they are to rise three fold again (for some courses).

Personally I can buy into the notion of tuition fees.  But not at the level now proposed....  It would be interesting to compare (say) the cost of a UK student studying here vs in Ireland or the US... because it could trigger a brain drain (removing the future high earning potential from the economy).  Plus I'm not sure how they will claw things back if someone simply moves abroad...

Quote
Personally I have no issue with students having to pay.  I actually think higher education is a choice whereas primary education is a statutory responsibility and should be free.  Courses which benefit society - such as medicine and its derivitatives should be subject to a discount and as a result the recipent should be contracted to the NHS for a period of time.  That's no different to a student on a Forces placement - you do your degree get paid while you are doing it and get your fees paid, in return you serve a period of years in the Forces.

Again I agree with this notion... possibly the same for teaching and other potentially (comparatively) low paid public service graduate positions..

Quote
Perhaps media studies should be sponsored by the BBC or some other media

Again I don't have a problem if it encourages people to think more about what they'll actually use their degree for when they graduate... maybe it will encourage more people back into science and engineering which would benefit the country as a whole (as there are shortages of applicants for universities in many of these areas to the point where the universities are cutting back places  :(

Actually this was always something that got me when I was at uni (triggered by a previous post from Drone) - whereas the people I shared a house with on Arts degrees had about 4 lectures a week, I had something like 14 + compulsory scheduled lab work + significant coursework...

Moley

Offline Drone

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Re: 10.11.10 - Demolition March - Central London
« Reply #45 on: November 12, 2010, 08:18:41 am »
Quote
Personally I have no issue with students having to pay.  I actually think higher education is a choice whereas primary education is a statutory responsibility and should be free. 

Which is why I say - introduce a graduate tax but apply it to everyone of working age who has been through the university system, including all those who benefitted from a free university education before fees were introduced.
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Offline Des Morgan

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Re: 10.11.10 - Demolition March - Central London
« Reply #46 on: November 12, 2010, 09:45:08 am »
Moley - Drone  -  Steady chaps we are agreeing on so much people will think we are forming a conspiracy.  Seriously, the points made are all very relevant and of course they need to be explored, examined and even deconstructed and put back together again in order to determine their integrity.

What did baffle me was the attitude of some of the 'students' - one 23 year olf from Trinity, Camb. thought it entirley right and proper to ransack and destroy property and buildings, declaring she got a 'buzz' from it.  One young man from Glasgow, who will not be affected by the charges (as Scotland does not charge Scottish students, but it does English students) was heard to declare he came for a fight with the English - what possesses them to utter such drivel?

I walked through Oxford the other day and marvelled at the colleges, their sense of orderliness and the evocation of history - past the Sheldonian and the Bodleian and on to St Johns.  It is a place of privilege not only open to the privileged but availale to those who would value the privilege - long may it be so

Offline Muggins

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Re: 10.11.10 - Demolition March - Central London
« Reply #47 on: November 12, 2010, 09:59:03 am »
I would be really cautious about using examples of students who are willing to be interviewed by the media. I bet for every 40 they asked only one 'nutter' would be interviewed and that they did it for the same reason as, like you, I felt were extreme examples. 

As usual, the people with something sensible to say were too busy saying it to one another or to those in charge, who were not listening anyway.

Lifes not always fair. Sometimes you can get a splinter even sliding down a rainbow. - Cherralea Morgen

Offline Spectre

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Re: 10.11.10 - Demolition March - Central London
« Reply #48 on: November 12, 2010, 01:54:24 pm »
Spectre makes his now usual rant on bigots etc, and how we treat overseas doctors, can I tell him that when I was 27, I had an heart attack, spent nearly a year in hospital in both germany and london, now recovered to the point where I have to have a check up every two years, this may, I went along for this check up and saw an indian or pakistani doctor, you never see the one in charge unless your a private patient or your actually in the heart ward and he comes round on his daily round check up.  I had the usual ecg tests and blood tests etc and this doctor told me that all was fine and asked me if I had any questions, I told that of late I was waking up in the night and my right arm was dead, if I sat up and raised the arm it come back to life and I then went back to sleep, he told me that it was sign of old age !!, and he then sent me a letter to confirm what he had said, a week later, I got a letter from the head man to say I had to come in the next day and have a full scan and to disreguard the diagnosis recently given!!, and Im sure you remember the 'qualified' german doctor, who when over here for his weekend overtime, killed the first patient he saw with an overdose of his dosage, and also the recent case in Devizes, where that overseas nurse switched off the life support machine of that man and didnt know how to restrart it..
Ill be glad to see the uk doctor and you can have the overseas ones mate......



Yet again,Kohima, you missed the salient point and in doing so reinforced the point I was making which is that with fees of up to £9000 per year over 6years there could be an acute shortage of "home" produced doctors in 10 years time.

In order to alleviate the problem it may be necessary to bring in doctors from "other" places. ::)

rant; rave in violent, high sounding language. Not me Sir, Surely. ;)



 :angel:




Offline Muggins

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Re: 10.11.10 - Demolition March - Central London
« Reply #49 on: November 12, 2010, 02:20:48 pm »
Put another way, do we at the complete mercy of the bloke that is stood over us with knife in hand, to have £54,000 debt on his mind?   

Or a healthy gratitutde to those who helped pay for his eduation?

I don't mind which flipping colour he/she is, so long as they know what they are doing. I would prefer to think that whilst they were at Uni learning their trade they could concentrate on the education, not having to find part time jobs to pay for it.

Perhaps we need to campaign to get special conditions for those doing that kind of job.

Come to think of it, don't some students do the required research to advance knowledge whilst at Uni? so are they not sort of working anyway?
Lifes not always fair. Sometimes you can get a splinter even sliding down a rainbow. - Cherralea Morgen

Offline kohima

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Re: 10.11.10 - Demolition March - Central London
« Reply #50 on: November 13, 2010, 09:00:13 am »
Im sure those who vocation to be a doctor will surmount any problems along the way,  the current pay for a doctor also makes the mind boggle. why do we read that these so called experts with  degrees coming out of ther backsides, cant get a job, and the degrees they hold must be in question, with such fancy titles, it makes the mind boggle, I was watching a programme on tv last night, the man who was answering the questions, had a degree, 6 a levels and about 5 or 6 (cant remember actual numbner) GCSEs, and he couldnt answer the question what does the statue of Nelson in London celebrate........... and he was told the name of the square where it stands........
the only thing from that demonstration is that they have arrested the idiot who threw that fire extinguisher off the roof.. surprise surprise he comes from a wealthy family..

 

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